Here are my PT #s.

10,345 total players
6,054 losers = 55.93%
4,771 winners = 44.07%

yeah, i know the #s dont add up, but thats what PT says.

Now remember that this is very short term for the vast majority of these players.

In answer to the question; daggone if i know.

I think I see where the difference lies between Jackpot Jay's stats and striker's.

It's called....The RAKE!

CJ

Despite what our friend Jackpot Jay had to say, I would be extremeley surprised to hear that anywhere near 40% of players are winners. If the number is above 20% I would be shocked.

kent - dont see you on the GC $50NLs anymore - new home?

Rake, rake, rake.

If it wasn't for rake, I'm sure a significant minority of players would make a profit, as is, 10% sounds much more likely than 20%. 40% is pretty much impossible.

This is albeit at the $25 NL level but some interesting reading on my PT database

All players (10940 players, 165,000 hands)
Winners 38.2% Losers 61.8%

Over 100 hands logged (3085)
Winners 46.3% Losers 53.7%

Over 250 hands logged (1165)
Winners 49.4% Losers 50.6%

Over 500 hands logged (469)
Winners 55% Losers 45%

This says to me that a lot of people are having a go, losing and not playing again and the majority of those who stay for any length of time are more likely to be winning players. I don't know if my database would be representative of poker players as a whole, but I found it quite an interesting find.

Kent - have you ever released much of that initial GC bonus - I am having a hell of a time releasing much of it at $100NL and $50NL, though I usually only play 1 table at GC at the same time as 3 @ paradise. Whats up with that?

I never got even one dollar of any GC bonus. Very irritating. But I gave up on getting it a long time ago.

I would say the 10% number is probably pretty close. I do believe that with the bonuses and lesser rake that come with online sites that many players that would be slight losers or break even players can show a long term profit, albeit a small one. The 44% number you are seeing in PT is nowhere close to reality because most of this data is on VERY short term data as most of the players in your database have a very limited number of hands which in reality mean nothing to the overall % of real winners.