Top 2, 3-way pot, coordinated board... ($200NL 6-max)

[stickdude]

Button is the reason I'm still at this table - he's a big fish (limping 82o on the button kind of fish). UTG+1 just sat down, and I don't recognize him -

$1/$2 No Limit Holdem
6 players
Converted at

Stacks:
UTG ($57.00)
UTG 1 ($96.00)
CO ($187.50)
BTN ($329.50)
SB ($294.65)
Hero ($206.20)

Pre-flop: ($3, 6 players) Hero is BB [Tc]
1 fold, UTG 1 calls $2, 1 fold, BTN calls $2, 1 fold, Hero checks

Flop: [8c][7d] ($7, 3 players)
Hero checks, UTG 1 bets $3.5, BTN raises to $14, Hero calls $14, UTG 1 raises to $59.5, BTN calls $45.5, Hero ?????

I'm fine getting it in with UTG+1, but with button having me covered and smooth-calling the re-raise, methinks I should proceed cautiously here - J9 and 96 are both very much in his range.

[charlie sheepskins]

[Zuccala]

That call is a bit nasty. By a bit I mean alot.

[iceman5]

Why did you check the flop?
Why did you just call the flop?

At this point there is no way to proceed cautiously. You either shove or fold.

[stickdude]

[k3nt]

So far you have a bet, a raise, a 3-bet, and a call, and you're just calling along. Normally I hate flat calling in part because you don't get any information about the other guys' hands and it's a coordinated board ... but you've sure got plenty of information about their hands by now. I think AGAINST NORMAL OPPONENTS putting one of them on 87 and the other on a big draw is the best you can hope for ... in which case they probably have a combined 15+ outs against you. On the other hand if you're behind you have a max of 4 outs. So against normal opponents I'd be tempted to fold this.

But if the big stack is a big fish then he probably plays like crap postflop as well as preflop. He can have a very very wide range here. I could see bad players of this type having as little as T2 here: he raises the 1/2 pot bet on the flop because he has top pair, and then he calls the raise because, well, he still has top pair.

So with top 2 I am willing to stack off here versus a half-stack unknown and also versus a full stack megafish. The only questions are: (1) will pushing at this point make the button fold everything you beat; (2) what happens if you flat call and another card comes that makes the board look really ugly. If you call the reraise and the turn is or a similar bad card, then I would be pot committed against the shorty anyway, so that part is irrelevant. The question is, do we have enough of a read on the button that we can fold if he bets a scare card like that? Some fish are so bad that they will bluff into an empty side pot, which would suck a lot; others are bad/predictable and won't bet a scary board unless they have it, which would make a flat call on the flop just fine.

I think your options are:

If you think the button is bad enough to call off all of his chips with any decent # of hands you're ahead of here, then shove right now;

If you think that he won't do that, then a shove is massively -EV and the option is between fold or call. If he's predictable postflop then I definitely call; if not, I lean toward a fold.

[iceman5]

Why check raise the flop and let a guy fold KT because you have an obvious 2 pair. People in the blinds do this all the time and it makes it very easy to get away from a one pair hand very cheaply. Not too mention you let everyone get a free card if nobody bets.

Just bet the flop and see what happens. If you want to check raise, do it on the turn.