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Do you push this river?

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Do you push this river?

Postby poker2006 » Thu Jun 09, 2005 10:19 pm

A lot of times I have a good hand on the river, but it's not the nuts. What do you do if your opponent has demonstrated some strength?? In both cases I don't have reads, I have less then 50 hands on the opponents.

Hand 1:

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ Hero (8 handed)

UTG ($65.9)
UTG+1 ($61.5)
MP1 ($50)
MP2 ($54.35)
CO ($61.35)
Button ($45.08)
SB ($44.8)
Hero ($50)

Preflop: Hero is BB with [9s], [Qs]. SB posts a blind of $0.25.
1 fold, UTG+1 raises to $1, MP1 calls $1, 1 fold, CO calls $1, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.50.

Flop: ($4.25) [Tc], [6h], [8d] (4 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets $0.5, MP1 folds, CO calls $0.50, Hero calls $0.50.

Turn: ($5.75) [7c] (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 checks, CO bets $2, Hero raises to $5, UTG+1 folds, CO calls $3.

River: ($15.75) [4h] (2 players)
Hero bets $5, CO raises to $20, Hero calls $15.

Final Pot: $55.75

Results in white below:
CO has Jh Jd (one pair, jacks).
Hero has 9s Qs (straight, ten high).
Outcome: Hero wins $55.75.


Hand 2:

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (9 handed)

MP2 ($65.5)
MP3 ($49.5)
CO ($53.05)
Button ($48.75)
Hero ($49.75)
BB ($24)
UTG ($56.4)
UTG+1 ($80.97)
MP1 ($55.82)

Preflop: Hero is SB with [Jd], [7d]. Hero posts a blind of $0.25.
2 folds, MP1 calls $0.50, 4 folds, Hero (poster) completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($1.50) [8d], [2d], [4d] (3 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, MP1 bets $1, Hero raises to $3, BB folds, MP1 calls $2.

Turn: ($7.50) [9c] (2 players)
Hero bets $4, MP1 raises to $10, Hero calls $6.

River: ($27.50) [8h] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets $8, Hero calls $8.

Final Pot: $43.50

Results in white below:
Hero has Jd 7d (flush, jack high).
MP1 has Ks 8s (three of a kind, eights).
Outcome: Hero wins $43.50.
-- andyG [Ah]
I try to learn something new every day. Winning comes by itself.
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Postby MVPSPORTS » Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:20 am

Hand 1: You have a pretty well hidden straight, and on the river, the only thing that beats you is J9... I probably would've raised the turn a little more, even though your straight came out, so did a flush draw... Honestly, I probably would've pushed the river... Like I said, he can only have 1 card that beats you, and I've seen LOTS of people have the 5 here for the low end of the straight... I think AT WORST, your gonna push this, and every once in a great while, you're gonna lose... But I think you're gonna take his stack MUCH more often... BTW... WHO THE HELL SLOWPLAYS Js?????

Hand 2: I would've bet more on the turn, and if he raised, I would've pushed... The last thing you want is some jackass w/ a naked [Ad] chasing to the river to kill you... You have the 4th nut flush, and the pot on the turn was big enough so that if he folded, I'd be happy...
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Postby greggabe » Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:38 am

Hand 1: I don't know if I entirely agree. I don't know how often you will see a five in that situation. Maybe Party's a bit different but I would say in the .5-1 and 1-2 games on NL you would see J9 doing that as often as you'd see a five. I just think if you push the river he's only calling with another 9, J9, and maybe a 5. I think the 5 is about as likely as J9 so that's a push and then you push on a naked nine. At best it's a breakeven move and is likely worse. I agree with MVP about raising more on the turn there though.

Hand 2: I agree almost word for word with MVP. You definitely need to bet more on the turn because you've got a vulnerable hand. If he comes over the top you push. If he calls and no diamond on the river then you pot it or just go all in.

I just looked at the results on hand two, you did get some extra cash the way you played it but I still think you have to be more aggressive with that hand to protect it and possibly get even more cash out of it.
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Postby MVPSPORTS » Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:48 am

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Postby greggabe » Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:51 am

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Postby MVPSPORTS » Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:58 am

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Postby kennyg » Fri Jun 10, 2005 5:29 am

I think you played hand #2 fine. Being out of position doesn't help you...you have no idea what MP has. I don't like a reraise on the turn because if he calls you have to act first on the river.

On the river you can't even think about raising because there is a full house and higher flush beating you.
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