Advanced search

Computers Solve Checkers ... very interesting

Everything from "Whats the best place to get a sandwich at Bellagio?" to "Damn, Shana Hiatt is FINE!".

Moderators: TightWad, LPF Police Department

Computers Solve Checkers ... very interesting

Postby pokerzen » Thu Jul 19, 2007 7:58 pm



Computers crack famous board game
Game of draughts (Eyewire)
Draughts has about 500 billion billion potential positions
It could be a case of game over for draughts - scientists say the ancient board game has finally been solved.

A Canadian team has created a computer program that can win or draw any game, no matter who the opponent is.

It took an average of 50 computers nearly two decades to sift through the 500 billion billion possible draughts positions to come up with the solution.

Writing in the journal Science, the team said it was the most challenging game solved to date.

Jonathan Schaeffer, lead author on the paper and chair of the department of computer science at the University of Alberta, told the BBC News website: "This was a huge computational problem to solve - more than a million times bigger than anything that had ever been solved before."

Trial and error

Professor Schaeffer, who admits he is "awful" at draughts (also known as checkers), began his attempts to solve the board game in 1989.

He consulted champion players to find out more about their game tactics and then fed this information into a computer program called Chinook.


I think we've raised the bar - and raised it quite a bit - in terms of what can be achieved in computer technology and artificial intelligence
Professor Schaeffer

Chinook looked at solving problems much like a human does by using trial and error to find out what appeared to be the best solutions. This is called a heuristic approach.

However, Professor Schaeffer said that although the program was extremely successful - it won the World Checkers Championship in 1994 - it was not perfect and occasionally lost games.

So the computer scientists tried another non-heuristic tack, where, over a number of years, hundreds of computers ran through game upon game of draughts to work out the sequences that would lead to winning, losing and drawing.

Eventually, the new program gathered so much information that it "knew" the best move to play in every situation. This meant that every game it played led to a certain win, or, if its opponent played perfectly, a draw.

Chess pieces
Chess may prove more tricky to solve

Professor Schaeffer said: "I think we've raised the bar - and raised it quite a bit - in terms of what can be achieved in computer technology and artificial intelligence."

With the vast number of playing possibilities, draughts is the most complex game to have been solved to date - it was about a million times more complicated to solve than Connect Four.

Researchers are now hoping to move on to even bigger problems, however it seems that grand master of the board games - chess - may remain unsolved for some time.

It has somewhere in the range of a billion billion billion billion billion possible positions, meaning that computers, with their current capacity, would takes aeons to solve it.
<Big_Leon> start with the RAZZ tourney?
<pokerzen1> when did the razz tourney start?
<Big_Leon> starts in 2 minutes
<Big_Leon> just drew seats
<pokerzen1> too late then
<pokerzen1> damn damn damn
<Big_Leon> no, it's not too late gogogogogo
<pokerzen1> what's the tourney number?
<Big_Leon> 55852225
<Big_Leon> password is - irunbad i think
<Big_Leon> irunbad
<pokerzen1> made it :)
<pokerzen1> okay now how do you play razz?
<Big_Leon> i have no idea
User avatar
pokerzen
Pro (Online)
 
Posts: 1742
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 12:36 pm
Location: I'm from Canada, eh.

Postby GodlikeRoy » Thu Jul 19, 2007 8:09 pm

Connect 4 has also been solved!
Poker is silly.

It is not enough to be good at chess, you must also play well.

Somewhere in the world someone is training when you are not. When you race him, he will win.

User avatar
GodlikeRoy
 
Posts: 7430
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2005 1:43 am

Postby emmasdad » Thu Jul 19, 2007 8:11 pm

Tic-tac-toe anyone?
User avatar
emmasdad
 
Posts: 5287
Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2006 4:29 pm
Location: Behind the Redwood Curtain

Postby GodlikeRoy » Thu Jul 19, 2007 8:15 pm

LOL @ ED.

Tic-tac-toe will never be solved.
Poker is silly.

It is not enough to be good at chess, you must also play well.

Somewhere in the world someone is training when you are not. When you race him, he will win.

User avatar
GodlikeRoy
 
Posts: 7430
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2005 1:43 am

Postby stickdude » Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:13 pm

When they've solved Go, let me know.
"My name is Inigo Montoya. You cracked my Aces... prepare to die"
User avatar
stickdude
 
Posts: 2155
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2005 12:04 pm
Location: Modesto, CA

Postby pokerzen » Fri Jul 20, 2007 6:20 am

<Big_Leon> start with the RAZZ tourney?
<pokerzen1> when did the razz tourney start?
<Big_Leon> starts in 2 minutes
<Big_Leon> just drew seats
<pokerzen1> too late then
<pokerzen1> damn damn damn
<Big_Leon> no, it's not too late gogogogogo
<pokerzen1> what's the tourney number?
<Big_Leon> 55852225
<Big_Leon> password is - irunbad i think
<Big_Leon> irunbad
<pokerzen1> made it :)
<pokerzen1> okay now how do you play razz?
<Big_Leon> i have no idea
User avatar
pokerzen
Pro (Online)
 
Posts: 1742
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 12:36 pm
Location: I'm from Canada, eh.

Postby Xaston » Fri Jul 20, 2007 6:30 am

Boy, you got me confused with a man who repeats himself.
User avatar
Xaston
 
Posts: 8833
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 1:45 pm
Location: Dartmouth, MA

Postby NorthView » Fri Jul 20, 2007 6:36 am

Mon May 12, 2008 1:46 am
When I play a patient and relaxed game I win - that simple.

Mon May 12, 2008 10:55 pm
Seriously, fuck poker.
==================================================================

[21:03] NorthViewBTP: mac is a fellow mexican
[21:03] Mekosking: yup
[21:03] NorthViewBTP: you should support your bro
[21:03] Mekosking: therefore hes a fat worthless tsr obv
User avatar
NorthView
 
Posts: 5998
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2005 8:02 am
Location: Not another flush card

Postby Pok 7's » Fri Jul 20, 2007 8:24 am

User avatar
Pok 7's
 
Posts: 3831
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2006 2:26 pm
Location: ...Halfway between card dead and missing flops

Postby antneye » Fri Jul 20, 2007 9:21 am

User avatar
antneye
 
Posts: 2216
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2006 5:23 am
Location: New York

Postby GodlikeRoy » Fri Jul 20, 2007 9:39 am

Poker is silly.

It is not enough to be good at chess, you must also play well.

Somewhere in the world someone is training when you are not. When you race him, he will win.

User avatar
GodlikeRoy
 
Posts: 7430
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2005 1:43 am

Postby Zmej » Fri Jul 20, 2007 10:01 am

"#3 pencils and quadrille pads."
- Seymoure Cray (1925-1996) when asked what CAD tools he used to design the Cray I supercomputer; he also recommended using the back side of the pages so that the grid lines were not so dominant.

"Interesting - I use a Mac to help me design the next Cray."
- Seymoure Cray (1925-1996) when he was told that Apple Inc. had recently bought a Cray supercomputer to help them design the next Mac.
User avatar
Zmej
 
Posts: 2307
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 5:44 am
Location: France. (Russian origin.)

Postby pokerzen » Fri Jul 20, 2007 10:39 am

<Big_Leon> start with the RAZZ tourney?
<pokerzen1> when did the razz tourney start?
<Big_Leon> starts in 2 minutes
<Big_Leon> just drew seats
<pokerzen1> too late then
<pokerzen1> damn damn damn
<Big_Leon> no, it's not too late gogogogogo
<pokerzen1> what's the tourney number?
<Big_Leon> 55852225
<Big_Leon> password is - irunbad i think
<Big_Leon> irunbad
<pokerzen1> made it :)
<pokerzen1> okay now how do you play razz?
<Big_Leon> i have no idea
User avatar
pokerzen
Pro (Online)
 
Posts: 1742
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 12:36 pm
Location: I'm from Canada, eh.

Postby pokerzen » Fri Jul 20, 2007 10:41 am

<Big_Leon> start with the RAZZ tourney?
<pokerzen1> when did the razz tourney start?
<Big_Leon> starts in 2 minutes
<Big_Leon> just drew seats
<pokerzen1> too late then
<pokerzen1> damn damn damn
<Big_Leon> no, it's not too late gogogogogo
<pokerzen1> what's the tourney number?
<Big_Leon> 55852225
<Big_Leon> password is - irunbad i think
<Big_Leon> irunbad
<pokerzen1> made it :)
<pokerzen1> okay now how do you play razz?
<Big_Leon> i have no idea
User avatar
pokerzen
Pro (Online)
 
Posts: 1742
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 12:36 pm
Location: I'm from Canada, eh.

Postby redhouse » Fri Jul 20, 2007 11:25 am

HU LHE is halfway solved. It should be done in another 3-5 years.
Mekos King: existence without running good
Mekos King: truly has no purpose
User avatar
redhouse
 
Posts: 1583
Joined: Wed Feb 16, 2005 1:21 am
Location: Stanford, CA

Next

Return to LPF Community

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests