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A scary new understanding

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A scary new understanding

Postby Cactus Jack » Wed Aug 24, 2005 4:31 am

"Are the players better as the stakes go up? It's not an exam; it's a buyin." Barry Tanenbaum
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Postby Tepshen73 » Wed Aug 24, 2005 8:22 am

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Postby k3nt » Wed Aug 24, 2005 11:09 am

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Postby Nortonesque » Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:09 pm

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Postby briachek » Wed Aug 24, 2005 2:11 pm

soon america will find a reason to invade every country til we own it all. Just give it time.
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Postby Dumb Snowman » Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:40 pm

Partake in my bollocks, bloody chav!
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Postby Sunbob » Thu Aug 25, 2005 12:10 am

I can really only speak to my industry, which is furniture. I am watching as all of the major manufacturers go to China. That is because China is the one building the new factories and investing in modernizing my industry. They also have so many people that labor is still cheap relative to the US and Europe.

The majority of any wood furniture you buy in US is made in China because it is cheaper to harvest wood in US, send it to China to make it into a table, and ship it back, then it is to make that same table in US. This has been going on for many years.

Now I am seeing sofas, especially leather, shifting to China as well. Many of the big Italian leather manufacturers are moving there for the cheap labor and modern plants.

This isn't just off brand names, either. It is old line - big names - like Thomasville, Natuzzi, Keller. It will help that China has started to float their currency instead of pegging it to the dollar. But until their labor costs come up to US and European level they will dominate in manufacturing.

This is where K3nt has the right idea - we still lead in technology and that is where we can still lead IF we are willing to invest the time and resources (money and effort). Unfortunately we have a leadership right now that wants to forget about our economy and just go to war. I'm afraid this is a distraction we can ill afford.

But I'm just a mattress and sofa salesman - I may be wrong.
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Postby tarheel1 » Thu Aug 25, 2005 9:35 am

If, after the first twenty minutes, you don't know who the sucker at the table is, it's you. ~Author Unknown
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Postby iceman5 » Thu Aug 25, 2005 12:02 pm

Whats your definition of "dominant power"?
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Postby rdale » Thu Aug 25, 2005 12:16 pm

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Postby k3nt » Thu Aug 25, 2005 12:26 pm

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Postby WildBillHickok » Thu Aug 25, 2005 1:30 pm

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Postby AlexMR » Thu Aug 25, 2005 5:37 pm

There is a lot USA can do to STAY as the world greatest suoer power it is.

I dont see that is going to happen, but definetely you can do it. The main thing I just dont understand is the poverty levels and education of the only real supoerpower left on the world.

You need to work, basically on education, in which, as of general population, you are way behind the levels of others rich nations. Illiteracy is simply nonexistent in most of them. You still have a few...

I just see the US system promotes the segregation at all levels, specially in education and that is costing you a lot. I have been in the USA for relatively long periods and I can truly say the public elementary education is quite deficient for such a rich country, with so many resources.

Education is what is going to cost USA the world leadership and that along with an awful exterior policy. I just dont see the USa as the Evil country so many other countries want to describe, I can tell it is not, but I can also say that its politics regarding international issues is just not right, being most of the time incrdibly hipocrit. I think USA has been exerting a very weak and interested leadership for the time it s been the greatest empire. For this reason, many people around the globe just think it s time for a new one. That added up, it seems that in the next 50years, China will be the the greatest superpower of the world.

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Postby Cactus Jack » Thu Aug 25, 2005 5:51 pm

I can't add anything to what K3nt wrote. Those would be some good parameters.

I too am fairly sure our time really has passed. I'm even more certain that if we have passed the peak of our power, we'll never get it back. I think there are a lot of reasons. Maybe the biggest is we're no longer enough of a homogenous society. I know of no country or culture that has come closer to the famous "melting pot" as the U.S. did, but I think this is more of a myth than reality. The Industrial Revolution began to really roll in England, but hit it's peak here in the U.S., when the country was mostly of European extraction. Spain, Portugal, France and Germany have all had great success in the past, and were homogenous. Japan is one of the most homogenous societies on Earth, and always have been. We are no longer a post-European country. Caucasians represent barely over half the population.

Now, before anyone starts screaming racism, I point this out as showing we have so many different cultures that we can have no national consensus. Each culture wants what's best for it, right or wrong. It's right for them, if not wrong for the country as a whole. As this has been happening for several decades, those who were responsible for the the tremendous success of the U.S. fear the loss of their power, not just in the country, but in the world.

Part of this shows up in the increasingly strong religious beliefs. Second it shows up in our need to use our military power. Think of it as like the husband who resorts to hitting his wife because he can control her no other way. Out of frustration and impotence--psychologically, not sexually--he lashes out.

The gentleman I discussed all this with suggested we may have to go to war to protect our supply of oil. I don't think he meant what we've already done. Resources have always been the cause of wars. Japan attacked the U.S. when we embargoed their oil. The Germans invaded Russia for the oil reserves in the Caucuses. Italy didn't offer enough resources, so the Romans went out and took what they wanted or thought they needed. Is there anyone so reasonable they would not be willing to fight for a tank of gas? I remember fist fights in gas lines in the 70s, so don't think this couldn't happen.

I can't remember when it was, but it was fifteen years or more that we became more a consumer than a producer. We import more than we export. Part of that is the tremendous economy and great wealth and standard of living we enjoyed over all others, but much of it is our resources have been exceeded by our ability to produce more. It's cheaper to buy than to make. If it cost 4.00 to run a car for a mile on hydrogen and gas is 2, there's no reason to put out the cost for a water-driven car. If gas goes to 5? Ah, then...

I really believe the man was right. The Chinese will eclipse us, sooner than we think. I guess we can ask the Spanish, the French and the English how to handle it. I know this: It's not going to be an easy transition. Evolution we can handle. Drastic change we don't like. We hate it. We'll fight it. And we'll lose.

学会讲中文。 (Learn to speak Chinese.)

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Postby k3nt » Fri Aug 26, 2005 10:09 am

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